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Post by David367th on Jan 12, 2017 15:16:00 GMT
jasonvance dragonkid11 I guess we have to do tests to see if mass for mass who wins. Also Aramid doesn't have to be in a composite, but I think it could double as a whipple shield if necessary.
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Post by The Astronomer on Jan 12, 2017 15:17:29 GMT
jasonvance They said Silica Aerogel ablates as fast as other materials. Is that true? Short answer: no If you ignore the density on it, yeah SA gets eaten through at a fairly high amount of cm/s. But if you take into account the low density it is still an okay anti-laser material, and has some uses for super light weight somewhat laser resistant armor. It does not share the same burn through rate as say graphite aerogel (the other low density contender). It gets heavily beat by aramid fiber in laser defense and beat by rubber in cost effectiveness, but if you need something light weight that will survive a scratch its still worth while. 100cm Silica aerogel will hold off a single high intensity laser for ~50 seconds 100cm Graphite aerogel will hold off a single high intensity laser for ~3 seconds 10 meters of graphite aerogel will hold off a single high intensity laser for ~20 seconds (this is the mass equivalent of 100cm silica aerogel) Can you check the 10 cm silica aerogel layer's laser tolerance compared with nitrile rubber and aramid fiber of the same mass (for universality, use it as a Stinger Drone's armor) for me, please? |
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Post by David367th on Jan 12, 2017 15:17:42 GMT
Yes thats true, silica has no resistance anymore. It isn't the godlike material it used to be but it isn't useless. Run tests and have numbers when talking about relative armor effectiveness. I did do tests in 1.0.8 Lasers thread I believe, and for thickness I found that silica doesn't last nearly as long as Aramid or Rubber at 1cm, I didn't think of doing mass to mass comparisons however. My campus froze over so I guess I got a lot of free time today. Short answer: no If you ignore the density on it, yeah SA gets eaten through at a fairly high amount of cm/s. But if you take into account the low density it is still an okay anti-laser material, and has some uses for super light weight somewhat laser resistant armor. It does not share the same burn through rate as say graphite aerogel (the other low density contender). It gets heavily beat by aramid fiber in laser defense and beat by rubber in cost effectiveness, but if you need something light weight that will survive a scratch its still worth while. 100cm Silica aerogel will hold off a single high intensity laser for ~50 seconds 100cm Graphite aerogel will hold off a single high intensity laser for ~3 seconds 10 meters of graphite aerogel will hold off a single high intensity laser for ~20 seconds (this is the mass equivalent of 100cm silica aerogel) Can you check the 10 cm silica aerogel layer's laser tolerance compared with nitrile rubber and aramid fiber of the same mass (for universality, use it as a Stinger Drone's armor) for me, please? Yeah I can get working on that. |
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Post by jasonvance on Jan 12, 2017 15:24:47 GMT
Short answer: no If you ignore the density on it, yeah SA gets eaten through at a fairly high amount of cm/s. But if you take into account the low density it is still an okay anti-laser material, and has some uses for super light weight somewhat laser resistant armor. It does not share the same burn through rate as say graphite aerogel (the other low density contender). It gets heavily beat by aramid fiber in laser defense and beat by rubber in cost effectiveness, but if you need something light weight that will survive a scratch its still worth while. 100cm Silica aerogel will hold off a single high intensity laser for ~50 seconds 100cm Graphite aerogel will hold off a single high intensity laser for ~3 seconds 10 meters of graphite aerogel will hold off a single high intensity laser for ~20 seconds (this is the mass equivalent of 100cm silica aerogel) Can you check the 10 cm silica aerogel layer's laser tolerance compared with nitrile rubber and aramid fiber of the same mass (for universality, use it as a Stinger Drone's armor) for me, please? You will likely want to go with rubber (as it will be the cheapest option by a lot) Aramid fiber will beat out SA on equal mass ratios as will rubber (by a lesser margin than AF) Here are some examples from my missile: 10cm silica aerogel 12.7kg 1,010c 1.9cm aramid fiber 12.3kg 2,570c 2.3cm rubber 12.7kg 391c base missile (without armor) 2.69kg 21.8c |
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Post by dragonkid11 on Jan 12, 2017 15:41:54 GMT
Silica aerogel definitely didn't last as long as aramid fiber.
But it's cheaper.
And it's pretty much the only thing that I tested that doesn't get cut down by gigawatt laser instantaneously and instead lasted for seconds.
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Post by jasonvance on Jan 12, 2017 15:43:22 GMT
Silica aerogel definitely didn't last as long as aramid fiber. But it's cheaper. And it's pretty much the only thing that I tested that doesn't get cut down by gigawatt laser instantaneously and instead lasted for seconds. Try rubber (I haven't fully tested it against all spectrum of lasers yet) it looks promising as a cheap anti-laser armor from the limited check I did on it |
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Post by The Astronomer on Jan 12, 2017 15:52:10 GMT
Which is the best of the three?
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Post by tukuro on Jan 12, 2017 15:52:21 GMT
You know what ships need? Figureheads. And menacing spikes.   That "skull" at the front is actually a black box engine. The model is at the moment extremely low poly and serves more as a proof of concept. The spikes are black box weapons, but sadly they create massive holes in the hull in battle mode. So until we have decorative modules we'll only have figureheads. The "paint" is iron oxide (right now it just uses the red refraction index). Now the only thing we need is a custom Jolly Rodger ensign.  If Captain Nemo built a spaceship instead of a submarine - this would be it. Really beautiful vessel. could you post a close-up of the front please. also, what are those things sticking from the front? radiators? And some tips on the paint job please. The things at the front are indeed radiators (boron nitride with gold finish). By using varying lengths and widths I was able to push one set away (using the coilguns at the front), and thus place two radiators in the same location in such a way that it looks like they're touching. The paint job involves a lot of decorative layers. The parallel lines were created using 3 overlapping layers (two gold and one silicon). The lines at the front exploit a glitch where layers sometimes clip if there isn't enough distance between them, it also uses a second layer to create a ring at the beginning of the tip. I prevent further clipping by selectively spacing the layers, and then arrange them in such a way that it isn't obvious that there is a distance between them. I'll upload it soon once I've tweaked a few of the remaining modules. Am I blind or is that not 9 layers of armor? 10 Actually. |
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Post by The Astronomer on Jan 12, 2017 15:58:38 GMT
You know what ships need? Figureheads. And menacing spikes. That "skull" at the front is actually a black box engine. The model is at the moment extremely low poly and serves more as a proof of concept. The spikes are black box weapons, but sadly they create massive holes in the hull in battle mode. So until we have decorative modules we'll only have figureheads. The "paint" is iron oxide (right now it just uses the red refraction index). Now the only thing we need is a custom Jolly Rodger ensign. If Captain Nemo built a spaceship instead of a submarine - this would be it. Really beautiful vessel. could you post a close-up of the front please. also, what are those things sticking from the front? radiators? And some tips on the paint job please. The things at the front are indeed radiators (boron nitride with gold finish). By using varying lengths and widths I was able to push one set away (using the coilguns at the front), and thus place two radiators in the same location in such a way that it looks like they're touching. The paint job involves a lot of decorative layers. The parallel lines were created using 3 overlapping layers (two gold and one silicon). The lines at the front exploit a glitch where layers sometimes clip if there isn't enough distance between them, it also uses a second layer to create a ring at the beginning of the tip. I prevent further clipping by selectively spacing the layers, and then arrange them in such a way that it isn't obvious that there is a distance between them. I'll upload it soon once I've tweaked a few of the remaining modules. Am I blind or is that not 9 layers of armor? 10 Actually. New request from High Command: create Thousand Sunny. We will pay 1Gc for the ship blueprint. just kidding, actually. |
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Post by David367th on Jan 12, 2017 16:20:42 GMT
The "paint" is iron oxide (right now it just uses the red refraction index). Couldn't you try to make an armor layer of Red z93? |
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Post by David367th on Jan 12, 2017 16:35:40 GMT
Ok so really quickly got a couple tests done with Aramid Fiber v Silica Aerogel. Using an armor test bed similar to Jason's laser challenge. 100cm of SA was used as the mass baseline which when converted to Aramid was 7.295cm both sitting at 1.31kt, 717m/s dV, 51.3mg. The laser used was a 95MW stock revamp from the 100MW Violet laser used on the Laser Frigate, fitted on a revamped Solar Lance. Around the standard location for the sandbox, Herculina, the test bed was set to aggressive to fly into the Lance. Both initial and final velocities were recorded. The laser was focused on the central axis engine of the test bed, and ablated away, starting at 50km, while time between orange armor tiles to black armor tiles were recorded.
Silica Aerogel1.31kt
113Mc
717m/s dv
51.3mg a Times | Trial # | Vi | Time to black | Vf | | 1 | 225m/s | 44.05s | 170m/s | | 2 | 147m/s | 58.75s | 163m/s | | 3 | 56m/s | 42.25s | 66.8m/s | | 4 | 117m/s | 56.01s | 134m/s | | 5 | 74.9m/s | 1:19.68s | 95.6m/s |
1.31kt 292Mc 717m/s dv 51.3mg a Times | Trial # | Vi | Time to black | Vf | | 1 | 51.4m/s | 1:54.18 | 86.5m/s | | 2 | 103m/s | 1:08.24 | 120m/s | | 3 | 62.6m/s | 1:51.93 | 93m/s | | 4 | 130m/s | 1:42.44 | 151m/s | | 5 | 150m/s | 1:19.17 | 171m/s |
Fancy imgur album of ships and lasers. |
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Post by newageofpower on Jan 12, 2017 17:46:45 GMT
Excellent data! Have you tried this with rubber yet? I've not yet tested nitrile rubber as a monolithic layer, only as part of a composite. |
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Post by David367th on Jan 12, 2017 18:20:26 GMT
Excellent data! Have you tried this with rubber yet? I've not yet tested nitrile rubber as a monolithic layer, only as part of a composite. 9.21cm 1.31kt 45.1Mc 717m/s dv 51.3mg a Times | Trial # | Vi | Time to black | Vf | | 1 | 188m/s | 54.13 | 203m/s | | 2 | 128m/s | 1:02.05 | 145m/s | | 3 | 201m/s | 48.76 | 214m/s | | 4 | 57.3m/s | 45.62 | 69.6m/s | | 5 | 50.8m/s | 46.15 | 65.9m/s |
Looks as if it's slightly worse or roughly the same, whichever way you look at it, than Silica Aerogel for half the cost. |
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Post by dragonkid11 on Jan 13, 2017 1:01:50 GMT
Hmmm, that's interesting.
Buttttt frankly, I'm too lazy to switch silica aerogel for something else because I used it on EVERYTHING.
That and my drone get hit the most often by energy laser anyway, which mean composite armor won't do because turret armor can't be mixed.
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Post by The Astronomer on Jan 13, 2017 1:18:38 GMT
Cost is not a problem in all of my ships. They all use cheap stuffs, so I'd prefer silica gel.
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