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Post by goduranus on Nov 5, 2016 8:28:23 GMT
So I was pondering about the greater effectiveness of multiple lasers vs one large laser, something to do with the damage of one weapon being capped by the vaporization energy(or something) of one "slice" of armor per game "tick". Having multiple weapons circumvents this limit by applying damage multiple times per tick. So as long as your small weapons reach the damage "cap", the damage you do is proportional to the number of weapons you have. That brings another interesting point, warheads seem to be considered "weapons" in game, they are basically lasers that apply damage across a 360 degree arc for one game tick. And there's another quirk where to improve game performance, all warheads of a same type seem to be proximity triggered at once. The conclusion? A nuke missile with multiple small warheads does far more damage than one with a single large warhead. Well, as long as the energy Fluence is above a damage cap, which I'm not sure of, since the measurement the game gives for laser fluence is different than nuke fluence. For lasers it seems to be capped at 200MW/m^2 against metals, and 100kW(yes kW) against aerogel. But wait, you say, a nuke with more warheads is wider and easier to shoot down, well, you just wait, I've found a game exploit to get around that was well, ehehehe. childrenofadeadearth.boards.net/thread/418/exploit-warhead-teleportation-point-defenseHere is the damage from a nuke with 20x6 kt warheads. Which disabled far more systems than the previous version that had a single 9.5Mt warhead.  |
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Post by someusername6 on Nov 5, 2016 8:36:03 GMT
How do those missile types compare?
Did the two tests have same detonation distance, same total fluence for the detonation distance, or something else?
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Post by dragonkid11 on Nov 5, 2016 8:52:01 GMT
Staph.
Game staph.
Staph making me wanting to optimize my EVERYTHING.
Seriously, nice find, goduranus.
Now I shall go nut on designing new missiles again.
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Post by goduranus on Nov 5, 2016 8:59:06 GMT
How do those missile types compare? Did the two tests have same detonation distance, same total fluence for the detonation distance, or something else? The single 9.5 Mt! nuke had much much much more total fluence than 19x 6.5kt nukes. Not too sure about distance, I tried my best to fly them the same way. |
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Post by dragonkid11 on Nov 5, 2016 9:02:34 GMT
It's odd how this game mimic real life sometimes...
Real world ICBM doesn't have a single warhead, but instead multiple warhead.
Either for redundancy purpose, or for making bigger boom while being 'cost-effective'(as cost-effective as nuclear weapon goes anyway.)
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Post by someusername6 on Nov 5, 2016 9:02:39 GMT
Right, my thought is that a 6kt nuke right next to the enemy might do more damage than a 9.1 Mt nuke that detonates from very far away. But I haven't tested that.
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Post by goduranus on Nov 5, 2016 9:06:30 GMT
Note how a single missile heavily damaged a whole formation of enemy ships. Both nukes flew somewhere through the enemy formation. On average, the distance between the 6kt and 9Mt to all enemy ships was about the same.
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Post by cuddlefish on Nov 5, 2016 9:08:45 GMT
It's odd how this game mimic real life sometimes... Real world ICBM doesn't have a single warhead, but instead multiple warhead. Either for redundancy purpose, or for making bigger boom while being 'cost-effective'(as cost-effective as nuclear weapon goes anyway.) The thing there is that the multiple warheads don't all travel together - they put twelve bombs in twelve different places, rather than only holding a single bomb of greater mass - much less wasted energy over-killing one thing, and more targets engaged per missile, lets you engage dispersed targets with greater effect from less effort. This, on the other hand, is just a math glitch of some sort. |
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Post by dragonkid11 on Nov 5, 2016 9:15:13 GMT
Well, tested out with my own version.
Apparently, some of the nuke also didn't detonate and ended up turning into KKV.
Or that the nuke ended up crashing through the ship hull and exploded on the other side because the camera was facing the other way.
Either way, this seems interesting enough for me to make us of large scale missiles.
Also WAY more cheaper than actual megaton nuke.
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Post by goduranus on Nov 5, 2016 9:20:42 GMT
Did you put the nukes one in front of another, or side by side? I think they have to be in the same group sitting side by side ie [6kt Pure fission nuke x 19], rather than [6kt Pure fission nuke x 5, 6kt Pure fission nuke x 5]
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Post by dragonkid11 on Nov 5, 2016 9:29:23 GMT
I have to stack them because there wasn't enough space left.
Also, I found a annoying problem.
Tried to put nearly 50 2.70 kt nuke in a single missiles.
For some reasons, everything starts lagging and as soon as I clicked away from it, the lag is gone.
I clicked back to the demonic multi-nuke missile and it lagged the hell out.
I deleted it just in case it might bugs out my game.
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Post by redparadize on Nov 5, 2016 9:29:35 GMT
You might have something there.
I noticed that a constant rain of smaller nuke was far more effective than a single much larger one. I ended up discarding my megaton nuke and only using the 2.66kt.
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Post by goduranus on Nov 5, 2016 9:31:08 GMT
I have to stack them because there wasn't enough space left. Also, I found a annoying problem. Tried to put nearly 50 2.70 kt nuke in a single missiles. For some reasons, everything starts lagging and as soon as I clicked away from it, the lag is gone. I clicked back to the demonic multi-nuke missile and it lagged the hell out. I deleted it just in case it might bugs out my game. I think only a single group will go off, so the most you can get is a group of 20. |
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Post by Rocket Witch on Nov 5, 2016 22:09:19 GMT
Interesting find. I did once assemble 100kg octogen blocks into a 'bundled grenade' type missile, but it would have to be huge and far worse than a nuke anyway so I scrapped it. I guess with this exploit it might actually be reasonably powerful (but still huge and easy to shoot down). I have to stack them because there wasn't enough space left. Also, I found a annoying problem. Tried to put nearly 50 2.70 kt nuke in a single missiles. For some reasons, everything starts lagging and as soon as I clicked away from it, the lag is gone. I clicked back to the demonic multi-nuke missile and it lagged the hell out. I deleted it just in case it might bugs out my game. The nuke module model seems to cause a significant performance drop. If you compare framerates when designing any other module to nuke design, you may find you're dropping around 40fps. Maybe it just has too many polygons. @qswitched are you aware of this? |
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Post by teeth on Nov 5, 2016 23:01:08 GMT
Nukes have weird graphical glitches, they become pitch black if you put certain materials into them and I imagine this has something to do with it. I've noticed the lag in the nuke editor and always assumed it was nuke equations being very taxing on hardware.
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