seeingstripes
New Member
Starwolf Industries: Designer of the cheapest microdrone ever put on the CDE Steam Workshop.
Posts: 15
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Post by seeingstripes on Sept 24, 2017 19:23:55 GMT
The goal: Create the cheapest possible combat-ready ship. Let's see some tiny, cheap, and deadly craft. Note: This is NOT a micro-drone contest, these have to have an actual crew compartment.
Requirements: -Price tag under 750 kc -Capable of defeating, at absolute minimum, 2 stock gunskiffs on its own, win/loss ratio of around 3/4 -5 km/s delta V -Must possess some form of full-hull, non-partial armor -Acceleration above 100mg at all times -Must have better than random chance survivability against missiles, whether decoys or point-defense -Must possess at least one weapon system; pure drone carriers not permitted -Obviously, must be independent capital ships; no drone cores
Primary scoring categories: Price tag, lethality, delta V
Primary Score = (750kc - price)*(delta V - 5.00 km/s)*(price of largest stock enemy force it can consistently defeat)
Secondary scoring categories: Acceleration, missile survivability, number of weapon systems mounted
Secondary Score = (dry acceleration - 100mg)*(armor mass)*(number of weapon systems mounted)
Primary score will be used to determine ranking, with secondary score breaking ties if necessary. Secondary scores will also have their own separate ranking, for alternative design philosophies. May the most frugal designer win.
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Post by tukuro on Sept 24, 2017 23:48:35 GMT
Incoming Budget-craft! Schematics: CrewModule [Budget] Command Module UsesCustomName true CrewCapacity 18 Decks 6 StructureMaterial Calcium ShellThickness_m 0.01
RailgunModule [Budget] 74 MW 29.4 km/s 5.2mm Railgun Description UsesCustomName true PowerConsumption_W 7.4e+007 Capacitor Count 1 DielectricComposition Water Dimensions_m 0.7 1.25 Separation_m 3.9e-006 Rails Composition Zirconium Copper Thickness_m 0.065 Length_m 4.2 BarrelArmor Composition Graphite Aerogel Thickness_m 0.31 Armature Composition Vanadium Chromium Steel BoreRadius_m 0.0026 Mass_kg 0.001 Tracer Neodymium Payload null Loader PowerConsumption_W 8e+005 ExternalMount false InternalMount false Turret InnerRadius_m 0.59 Extruded true ArmorComposition Amorphous Carbon ArmorThickness_m 0.04 MomentumWheels Composition Selenium RotationalSpeed_RPM 4200 AttachedAmmoBay Capacity 40000 Stacks 1 TargetsShips true TargetsShots true
SpacerModule [Budget] Spacer UsesCustomName true Dimensions_m 0.5 1.5
ThermoelectricFissionReactorModule [Budget] 150 MW Fission Reactor UsesCustomName true ReactorCoreDimensions_m 0.16 0.1 NuclearReactor Coolant Sodium Moderator Diamond ModeratorMass_kg 0 Fuel U-233 Dioxide FuelMass_kg 4.6 FuelEnrichment_Percent 0.97 ControlRodComposition Tantalum Hafnium Carbide ControlRodMass_kg 100 NeutronReflector Diamond ReflectorThickness_m 0 AverageNeutronFlux__m2_s 6.36e+019 InnerTurbopump Composition Diamond PumpRadius_m 0.58 RotationalSpeed_RPM 580 ThermocoupleInnerDimensions_m 1.89 1.89 Thermocouple PTypeComposition Osmium NTypeComposition Tungsten Length_m 0.001 ThermocoupleExitTemperature_K 2500 OuterCoolant Sodium OuterTurbopump Composition Aluminum PumpRadius_m 0.35 RotationalSpeed_RPM 380
PropellantTankModule [Budget] 10 t Methane Tank UsesCustomName true Propellant Methane StructureComposition Vanadium Chromium Steel ReactionMass_kg 10000 HeightToRadiusRatio 20 AdditionalArmorThickness_m 0
ResistojetModule [Budget] 7.10 km/s 149 MW Methane Resistojet UsesCustomName true PowerSupplied_W 1.5e+008 Propellant Methane CoilComposition Tantalum Hafnium Carbide ChamberLength_m 0.01 CoilRadius_m 0.0001 ThermalRocket ChamberComposition Amorphous Carbon ThroatRadius_m 0.07 ChamberWallThickness_m 0.0022 ChamberContractionRatio 4.6 NozzleExpansionRatio 71.7 NozzleExpansionAngle_degrees 17 RegenerativeCooling_Percent 1 Injector Composition Potassium PumpRadius_m 0.19 RotationalSpeed_RPM 300 Gimbal InnerRadius_m 0.28 ArmorComposition Boron ArmorThickness_m 0.0001 MomentumWheels Composition Selenium RotationalSpeed_RPM 5300 GimbalAngle_degrees 15
PropellantTankModule [Budget] 10 t Methane Tank - External Back UsesCustomName true Propellant Methane StructureComposition Vanadium Chromium Steel ReactionMass_kg 10000 HeightToRadiusRatio 20 AdditionalArmorThickness_m 0 External ExplosiveBoltMass_kg 0.1 ExplosiveBoltComposition Cyclonite
RadiatorModule [Budget] Crew Module Radiator UsesCustomName true Composition Vitreous Carbon PanelWidth_m 0.05 Height_m 6 Thickness_m 0.001 ArmorThickness_m 0.001 Panels 20 FrontTaper_radians 1.301 BackTaper_radians 0.777 SurfaceFinish Silicon Nitride
RadiationShieldModule [Budget] 5.5 m Radiation Shield UsesCustomName true Composition Lithium-6 Dimensions_m 2.25 0.005
RadiatorModule [Budget] Radiator - Back UsesCustomName true Composition Amorphous Carbon PanelWidth_m 0.4 Height_m 6.5 Thickness_m 0.001 ArmorThickness_m 0.001 Panels 20 FrontTaper_radians 0.645 BackTaper_radians 0.35 SurfaceFinish Silicon Nitride
RadiatorModule [Budget] Radiator - Front UsesCustomName true Composition Amorphous Carbon PanelWidth_m 0.3 Height_m 0.5 Thickness_m 0.001 ArmorThickness_m 0.001 Panels 10 FrontTaper_radians 1.344 BackTaper_radians 0.194 SurfaceFinish Silicon Nitride
PropellantTankModule [Budget] 10 t Methane Tank - External Front UsesCustomName true Propellant Methane StructureComposition Vanadium Chromium Steel ReactionMass_kg 5000 HeightToRadiusRatio 10 AdditionalArmorThickness_m 0 External ExplosiveBoltMass_kg 0.1 ExplosiveBoltComposition Cyclonite
CraftBlueprint [Budget] Modules [Budget] Command Module 1 0 null 0 [Budget] 74 MW 29.4 km/s 5.2mm Railgun 2 35.418 null 0 [Budget] Command Module 1 1 null 0 [Budget] Spacer 1 0.5 null 0 [Budget] 150 MW Fission Reactor 1 -0.5 null 0 [Budget] 10 t Methane Tank 8 -0.25 null 0 [Budget] 7.10 km/s 149 MW Methane Resistojet 1 -0.25 null 0 10.0 m x 0 m Spacer 1 49.847 null 0 [Budget] 10 t Methane Tank - External Back 2 13.1 null 0.29 [Budget] 10 t Methane Tank - External Back 2 13.1 null 2.85 [Budget] Crew Module Radiator 2 28.166 [Budget] Command Module 1.57 [Budget] 5.5 m Radiation Shield 1 -0.125 null 0 [Budget] Radiator - Back 2 13.191 [Budget] 150 MW Fission Reactor 4.72 [Budget] Radiator - Front 2 43.292 [Budget] 150 MW Fission Reactor 4.71 [Budget] 10 t Methane Tank - External Front 2 27.76 null 0 Armor ArmorLayers Graphite Aerogel 0.1 0 0 1 1 Zinc 0.0005 0 0 1 1 Aluminum 0.0005 0.005 0 1 0.52
746 kc, 5.25 km/s Δv & 249 tUse instructions: At the start of the battle angle your ship ~22.5 degrees "up" or "down". Against kinetics face your zinc armor towards the enemy, in case of lasers turn your aluminium side towards them. If you are up against missiles burn away at first to reduce closing velocity, then during the battle phase turn 90 degrees while having both guns face the enemy. Largest defeated ship: Gunship. (I guess that gives a score of 28600? 4*25*286) I'm sort of surprised really. This makes me wonder if with a few additions (Neon MPD, additional railgun, perhaps F-CH 4 micromissiles) you could run the campaign with this. For under 1 MC. The price can be reduced further (To 706 kc) if you change the command module material from calcium to potassium. But that makes them even more fragile, and this felt slightly less cheesy. Perhaps you could create your own opponents? Unless of course you want the challenge to be the "Cheapest way to defeat a Gunship/Carrier without drones".
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Post by jtyotjotjipaefvj on Sept 25, 2017 16:43:07 GMT
I managed to beat three gunships with this highly technical design: it technically has armor and technically it has a weapon in addition to the missile launchers. Design blueprints for ship, launcher and missile: My original plan was to do a high velocity intercept to avoid missiles and quickly spit out the full missile storage and then use the high acceleration to escape but that turned out to be unnecessary. Since the micromissiles can take down flak missiles easily enough, I can do a slow approach and hover at 150 km, slowly launching missiles when needed. With better rationing and some luck, the missile storage might be able to take down a fourth gunship too, but I can't be bothered to optimize so much. Below is a combat video in two parts since I accidentally stopped recording after the missiles were done and I can't be bothered to glue the clips together. Proof of PD capabilities: Proof of Gunship-destroying capabilities: Weirdly enough the missiles seem to have better accuracy against flak missiles. You'd think the gunship would be an easier target to hit but you'd be wrong! As for points, I think I earned 3 kc * 1.03 km/s * 858 Mc = 2.65 * 10^12 c²m/s points. For secondary score I got 3.01 g * ~10 kg * (2 or 6 depending on how you count) = 590 kgm/s² = 590 kN. Or 1.77 MN if each launcher counts as a separate system. Your point system is pretty silly btw.
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seeingstripes
New Member
Starwolf Industries: Designer of the cheapest microdrone ever put on the CDE Steam Workshop.
Posts: 15
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Post by seeingstripes on Sept 26, 2017 15:59:22 GMT
The point system was just meant to be some kind of semi-objective judge of performance. Also, I had figured you'd just use the unit-less values for score, though it's interesting to see what the unit cancellation does. Second note: If you wanted to mount only missile launchers, that would be permitted. You don't /have/ to have kinetic or laser guns if you don't want to. Multiple different types of missile launchers would count.
Also, clarification: "Different weapon systems" are defined as being different enough to require separate ammunition supplies.
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Post by madmike on Sept 27, 2017 6:02:30 GMT
This doesn't technically qualify because I couldn't be arsed to min-max until my ΔV>5km/s, but otherwise I'm pretty sure this fits. I present to you the Thermopylae-class gunboat. CarrierModule 2.50 kW Mid. Ind. - Micro Missile Launcher
UsesCustomName false
Payload Mid. Ind. - Micro Missile
Launcher
Stator Nickel
TrackLength_m 0.3
StatorDepth_m 0.05
Forcer Zirconium Copper
ForcerRadius_m 0.008
Coolant Sodium
PowerConsumption_W 2500
CoolantTurbopump
Composition Boron Carbide
PumpRadius_m 0.05
RotationalSpeed_RPM 1000
CoolantInletTemperature_K 1300
ArmorMaterial Boron Filament
ArmorThickness_m 0.05
EngagementRange_km 250
TargetsShips true
TargetsShots false
LaunchCountCap 150
ConventionalGunModule 6mm Turreted Cannon
UsesCustomName false
Barrel
Composition Vanadium Chromium Steel
Length_m 1
Thickness_m 0.03
BarrelArmor
Composition Diamond
Thickness_m 0.05
Propellant
Composition Octogen
Mass_kg 0.0055
GrainRadius_m 0.0014
Projectile
Composition Osmium
BoreRadius_m 0.0034
Mass_kg 0.001
Tracer Strontium Nitrate
Payload null
Loader
PowerConsumption_W 5000
ExternalMount false
InternalMount false
Turret
InnerRadius_m 0.2
Extruded true
ArmorComposition Nitrile Rubber
ArmorThickness_m 0.025
ElectricActuators
PermanentMagnet Neodymium Iron Boron
PowerConsumption_W 10000
TargetsShips true
TargetsShots true
CrewModule 30 Crew Module (Cheap)
UsesCustomName true
CrewCapacity 30
Decks 5
StructureMaterial Potassium
ShellThickness_m 0.049
PropellantTankModule 100 t Methane Tank 2
UsesCustomName false
Propellant Methane
StructureComposition Diamond
ReactionMass_kg 1e+005
HeightToRadiusRatio 7
AdditionalArmorThickness_m 0
PropellantTankModule 400 t Oxygen Tank (Diamond)
UsesCustomName true
Propellant Oxygen
StructureComposition Diamond
ReactionMass_kg 4e+005
HeightToRadiusRatio 10
AdditionalArmorThickness_m 0
RadiationShieldModule 1.00 m Diameter 35.0 cm Radiation Shield
UsesCustomName false
Composition UHMWPE
Dimensions_m 0.5 0.35
AmmoModule 1000x Mid. Ind. - Micro Missile
UsesCustomName false
SuppliedModule 2.50 kW Mid. Ind. - Micro Missile Launcher
AmmoBay
Capacity 1000
Stacks 2
ArmorComposition Aluminum
ArmorThickness_m 0.001
AmmoModule 5000x 6mm Cannon Round
UsesCustomName false
SuppliedModule 6mm Turreted Cannon
AmmoBay
Capacity 5000
Stacks 2
ArmorComposition Diamond
ArmorThickness_m 0.001
CraftBlueprint Thermopylae-class Gunboat
Modules
30 Crew Module (Cheap) 1 3.0494 null 0
3km/s 1MN Methalox G-Rocket (Cheap) 1 0 null 0
100 t Methane Tank 2 1 0 null 0
400 t Oxygen Tank (Diamond) 1 0 null 0
2.50 kW Mid. Ind. - Micro Missile Launcher 2 47.319 null 0
6mm Turreted Cannon 1 68.531 null 0
1000x Mid. Ind. - Micro Missile 1 0 null 0
6x2 Amorphous Carbon Radiator 2 5.1674 30 Crew Module (Cheap) 0
0.2x0.2 Amorphous Carbon Radiator 2 10.243 2.50 kW Mid. Ind. - Micro Missile Launcher 0
20 kW Cobalt-60 RTG 1 1.5247 null 0
2x1 Magnesium Radiator 2 7.9853 20 kW Cobalt-60 RTG 0
1.00 m Diameter 35.0 cm Radiation Shield 1 2.2871 null 0
3.15 km/s 41.4 kN LOX Methane Gimballed Combustion Rocket 2 44.185 null 0
5.00 m x 0 m Spacer 1 64.806 null 0
5000x 6mm Cannon Round 1 68.531 null 0
Armor
ArmorLayers
Aluminum 0.01 0 0.75 1 1
Graphite Aerogel 0.2 0 0.75 1 1
Aluminum 0.002 0 0.75 1 1
It's less a gunboat and more of a somewhat orky missile skiff with a couple of (possibly sarcastic) nods to crew survivability. The Thermopylae's primary armament consists of two micromissile launchers (said micromissiles shamelessly stolen borrowed from midnightdreary) with 1000 missiles between them. They can empty that magazine in around 30s with the launch count limiter turned off (which is honestly there just to spare my poor zombie of a CPU), and pretty much shred anything unprotected a laserstar or heavy armor. The gun is mostly just for light CIWS, though it's deadly enough to any capitals within its range. Armor was possibly my biggest cost-cutting area. It basically has an Al/aerogel sandwich that only covers the absolute vitals, and even then it won't stop much more than a laser or small sandblaster. It's enough to save the crew from stray shots, but you really just want to not get hit to begin with. Thankfully, the missiles give you a pretty solid standoff range. Oh, also, credit to RocketWitch for the engine, which I pulled from her China-class. I still can't for the life of me figure out how to design decent engines, let alone hitting extremes like this. Edit: It seems with some armor tweaks I can bring the ΔV to 5km, but honestly I don't feel like reposting the tweaked version. Basically just swap the inner Al layer for this if you care to. Titanium 0.01 0 0.92 1 1
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Post by treptoplax on Sept 27, 2017 15:22:28 GMT
You know, these designs would be interesting as drones if you just replaced the crew compartment (and would cost less than the stock drones, which is kinda hilarious).
Hoping to post one myself this weekend but I want to improve survivability a bit (and I'm clearly behind the state-of-the-art in micromissiles). The cute thing about my current draft is that it uses only RTGs for power; that limits secondary weapons to conventional cannons (I'm currently leaning to a high-slug-mass low-velocity gun which depends on high intercept speed and is quite effective if you have it), but the heat signature with engines off is only 40Kw (!), which means the micromissiles work perfectly well as decoys.
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Post by jtyotjotjipaefvj on Sept 27, 2017 15:48:25 GMT
Just think of the lag when every drone would launch 35 missiles per second. It wouldn't be fun.
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seeingstripes
New Member
Starwolf Industries: Designer of the cheapest microdrone ever put on the CDE Steam Workshop.
Posts: 15
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Post by seeingstripes on Sept 27, 2017 16:02:43 GMT
treptoplaxIf you really need em, I could post my own micromissile design. This is for everyone, too. Might be fun to offer a 'standard' weapon, or let each person design their own.
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Post by treptoplax on Sept 28, 2017 23:49:27 GMT
treptoplax If you really need em, I could post my own micromissile design. This is for everyone, too. Might be fun to offer a 'standard' weapon, or let each person design their own. No problem, like madmike I cribbed some designs off Steam Workshop by @midnightdrearydreary (I think? Midnight Industries on workshop) and then I just used them as a reference. Copying the control scheme was the main thing; I had a bunch of tiny missiles already but they were mostly KKMs intended to act as laser bait while my usual gun drones got into kill range - I honestly was barely concerned whether they could hit anything or not. For that matter there's some sweet stuff on the micromissiles "kilocredit challenge" thread running right now. Anyhow, good challenge, I already found some nice tweaks to some of my standard stuff I would never have bothered looking at otherwise. I'll post my little missile skiff once I have time to make another pass over the chemguns; they're currently firing 14g (!) slugs at 1.9Km/s, but the ammo cost is actually relevant in this challenge so I want to see if I can slim that down without losing lethality.
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seeingstripes
New Member
Starwolf Industries: Designer of the cheapest microdrone ever put on the CDE Steam Workshop.
Posts: 15
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Post by seeingstripes on Sept 29, 2017 1:11:20 GMT
treptoplax If you really need em, I could post my own micromissile design. This is for everyone, too. Might be fun to offer a 'standard' weapon, or let each person design their own. No problem, like madmike I cribbed some designs off Steam Workshop by @midnightdrearydreary (I think? Midnight Industries on workshop) and then I just used them as a reference. Copying the control scheme was the main thing; I had a bunch of tiny missiles already but they were mostly KKMs intended to act as laser bait while my usual gun drones got into kill range - I honestly was barely concerned whether they could hit anything or not. For that matter there's some sweet stuff on the micromissiles "kilocredit challenge" thread running right now. Anyhow, good challenge, I already found some nice tweaks to some of my standard stuff I would never have bothered looking at otherwise. I'll post my little missile skiff once I have time to make another pass over the chemguns; they're currently firing 14g (!) slugs at 1.9Km/s, but the ammo cost is actually relevant in this challenge so I want to see if I can slim that down without losing lethality. Fourteen grams at almost 2 km/s? I'm excited already, those must be some good guns. Especially if they're light and cheap enough to fit into this challenge! Also, while that challenge is fascinating, it's not quite my style. I prefer the missile version of a Zerg Rush, saturating PD attempts with hundreds of tiny missiles. Since my smallest flak missile weighs 3 kilos, costs 7.5 creds, and delivers a 1-kilo flak bomb, I feel pretty comfortable with my method.
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Post by jtyotjotjipaefvj on Sept 29, 2017 9:01:32 GMT
Here's a pretty neat gun if you want to use conventional guns. 2 km/s with 940g bullet, 9 shots per second for 22.3 kc and 2.8 tons
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Post by jtyotjotjipaefvj on Sept 29, 2017 22:25:57 GMT
Here's a design utilizing conventional guns. It fulfills all the criteria as well: 5.02 km/s dv, 749 kc cost and it has two 17mm machine guns that do nothing. However, its main armament is two gun platform launchers that shoot out a total of 16 125mm gun satellites that can quickly chew pretty much any armor. With 360 RPM, a 1 kg slug and approximately 3 km/s impact velocity after taking into account relative velocity to the target, they pack quite a punch. The generous dv on the launcher ship allows it to flee combat before going into the enemy's weapon range, which means it doesn't really need to be armored at all. Designs for everything below: Combat video: For points I got 1 kc * 0.02 km/s * 283,000,000 Mc = 5.66 megapoints. Sadly this design is about 10,000 times worse than my previous one. Just goes to show you that missiles are really efficient.
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Post by newageofpower on Sept 29, 2017 22:45:13 GMT
Primary Score = (750kc - price)*(delta V - 5.00 km/s)*(price of largest stock enemy force it can consistently defeat) Be warned gunships are hilariously expensive for their capability, for whatever reason.
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Post by treptoplax on Sept 30, 2017 1:39:14 GMT
Well, this is not too different from some of the earlier submissions, but nonetheless I present the Reepicheep-class missile skiff. 150 flak missiles with 9Km/s dV and a 2Kg warhead, and two 22mm/12g chemguns optimized for long-range fire. Because of its low heat signature, the missiles are adequate IR decoys if the main engine is disabled. Armor covers the whole ship, but it's made mostly of vacuum and optimism; it'll hold off moderate lasers long enough to start launching missiles, but is marginal at best against kinetic threats. Due to its high broadside acceleration, it can handle a couple of gunskiffs just with its own guns. With the missiles it can take out quite a number of those, or at least one stock gunship (probably several if you're careful, lucky, or avoid close engagements altogether).
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Post by The Astronomer on Sept 30, 2017 1:41:09 GMT
If you want expensive shit-tier ship to defeat, try hiveship. Aim for its nuke cannon, and everything's over for it.
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