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Post by srbrant on Jul 20, 2018 17:52:55 GMT
This is a thought I've had recently. I've found that the severity of a hull breach is dependent on the ratio between the size of the room and the size of the hole punched into it. In my story, oxygen generators and scrubbers are very compact and abundant, allowing for ample breathing room so I don't think it should have too much of an issue in this case. Have the rooms be larger, but have multiple platforms, terraces and catwalks to minimize wasted space. This way, there is more time for a breach to be sealed, more time to save lives, reduced feelings of claustrophobia and a much cooler and dramatic-looking interior.
Your thoughts?
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Post by Pttg on Jul 20, 2018 22:48:59 GMT
The larger the living space, the more hull needs to be armored.
Also, if you're in a battle situation, why the hell are your pilots out of their pressure suits? Suit up, depressurize the cabin, and the habitat can tank a few hits just fine.
If your crews are feeling a little cooped up, tell them to spend their off shifts in VR.
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Post by apophys on Jul 21, 2018 0:26:35 GMT
Consider the analogy of a naval ship's hull. The space is compartmentalized into more easily manageable spaces that can be quickly sealed off from each other in the event of a breach (but otherwise left open). At worst, you only lose one compartment of air, and anyone still conscious inside doesn't have too far to go to an airlock and save themselves (or similarly, any attempted rescuer doesn't have too far to go to a victim, saving time and possibly preventing brain damage due to lack of oxygen).
I expect the largest regular spaces to be about the size of a school gym. You can have as many of them as you need, though.
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Post by Rocket Witch on Jul 21, 2018 0:26:55 GMT
A larger room will get hit more times. Many small rooms allow breaches to be contained, but the walls cost mass, so ironically the cheaper ships might look grander on the inside. Also, if you're in a battle situation, why the hell are your pilots out of their pressure suits? Suit up, depressurize the cabin, and the habitat can tank a few hits just fine. Where do you move the air to? A smaller volume to keep it safer, I assume, or why move it at all? That's okay but the consequence of structural failure of the air tanks — an explosion — means it may be safer just to leave the air in the crew area and close off breached sections, while persons working in these sections have their suits fed by umbilicals from neighbouring intact ones. |
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Post by AtomHeartDragon on Jul 21, 2018 10:38:28 GMT
Also, if you're in a battle situation, why the hell are your pilots out of their pressure suits? Suit up, depressurize the cabin, and the habitat can tank a few hits just fine. This. CM pressurization in combat accomplishes 3 things: - Provides abundant oxidizer to help any fires spread.
- Provides medium for shockwave propagation allowing even impacts that don't directly hit anyone (with projectile or spallation) to kill people.
- Provides opportunity of death by decompression.
...neither of which is particularly desirable.
In combat everyone should be suited up, strapped to their acceleration couch and the habitat depressurized. That way you can shoot CM full of holes and everyone not hit directly is still going to live.
As for the living space, I would expect inflatable habs to be carried and used away from combat zones. They could be deployed internally - in any free, not-irradiated spaces - or externally providing huge amounts of living space, they could be used as lifeboats (with small disposable rocket motors or even jerry-rigged missile/drone propulsion buses) should the evacuated vessel be on escape or collision trajectory, they could be used to provide spare habitability for own evacuated crews or POWs, they would allow much denser crew packing in *combat* CMs (minimalistic sardine-can CIC/storm cellar) and they would be less susceptible to battle damage (due to being deflated and stowed before combat).
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Post by Rocket Witch on Jul 21, 2018 20:32:00 GMT
- Provides medium for shockwave propagation allowing even impacts that don't directly hit anyone (with projectile or spallation) to kill people. - Provides opportunity of death by decompression. - How likely is this? I've never heard of people inside ships/tanks/bunkers dying from shockwaves as such, but there are accounts of watching glowing hot shells passing next to them without being harmed. - A sudden drop from 1 to 0 bar (and most drops won't be sudden) is not too much for even an unaided human body to withstand, let alone persons in IVA suits. |
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Post by AtomHeartDragon on Jul 21, 2018 20:41:18 GMT
- Provides medium for shockwave propagation allowing even impacts that don't directly hit anyone (with projectile or spallation) to kill people. - Provides opportunity of death by decompression. - How likely is this? I've never heard of people inside ships/tanks/bunkers dying from shockwaves as such, but there are accounts of watching glowing hot shells passing next to them without being harmed. - A sudden drop from 1 to 0 bar (and most drops won't be sudden) is not too much for even an unaided human body to withstand, let alone persons in IVA suits. Glowing hot shells typically don't pass people at several km/s, and when you have already suited up there is really no reason to keep the air around for the duration of battle.
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Post by Rocket Witch on Jul 21, 2018 20:54:00 GMT
when you have already suited up there is really no reason to keep the air around for the duration of battle. Where would you put it? |
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Post by diamondback on Jul 22, 2018 2:04:15 GMT
I think the inflatable habs idea makes a lot of sense, the weight savings allow for a lot more armor/ radiation shielding for the sardine can bunker spaces for combat or a radiation storm.
But to second Rocket Witch, that air has to go somewhere and pressurizing it makes it quite an explosion hazard without any need to be ignited, only punctured. I suppose it could just be well armored? It's not the only explosion hazard on the ship.
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Post by AtomHeartDragon on Jul 22, 2018 8:24:48 GMT
I think the inflatable habs idea makes a lot of sense, the weight savings allow for a lot more armor/ radiation shielding for the sardine can bunker spaces for combat or a radiation storm. But to second Rocket Witch, that air has to go somewhere and pressurizing it makes it quite an explosion hazard without any need to be ignited, only punctured. I suppose it could just be well armored? It's not the only explosion hazard on the ship. It wouldn't be more of an explosion hazard than most propellant tanks. Besides, explosions are rather wimpy in vacuum and you can design pressure vessel to fail predictably without fragmenting (and if you can't - you can aim for large fragments and put it in a cage).
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Post by srbrant on Jul 22, 2018 22:23:20 GMT
So yeah, lining the habitat space with smaller rooms is better for that reason, with the largest rooms in the center. Still, the thought of someone sleeping in their cabin being rudely awakened by their body getting mulched into tomato paste from an exit hole is not one I enjoy entertaining.
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Post by AtomHeartDragon on Jul 23, 2018 18:29:43 GMT
So yeah, lining the habitat space with smaller rooms is better for that reason, with the largest rooms in the center. Still, the thought of someone sleeping in their cabin being rudely awakened by their body getting mulched into tomato paste from an exit hole is not one I enjoy entertaining. Well, intercepts being brief and violent, it's not like you're going to sleep while being shot at. |
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Post by srbrant on Jul 25, 2018 3:33:19 GMT
So yeah, lining the habitat space with smaller rooms is better for that reason, with the largest rooms in the center. Still, the thought of someone sleeping in their cabin being rudely awakened by their body getting mulched into tomato paste from an exit hole is not one I enjoy entertaining. Well, intercepts being brief and violent, it's not like you're going to sleep while being shot at. A fair point. |
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Post by coaxjack on Jul 27, 2018 8:07:57 GMT
And if you decide to sneak off and take a nap during a combat engagement, you'd probably rather be converted to pink mist quickly by a 7 km/s stream of rail sand, because the boatswain on duty will convert you to a pink mist very slowly if the ship survives.
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Post by srbrant on Jul 27, 2018 15:59:52 GMT
And if you decide to sneak off and take a nap during a combat engagement, you'd probably rather be converted to pink mist quickly by a 7 km/s stream of rail sand, because the boatswain on duty will convert you to a pink mist very slowly if the ship survives. And in front of the entire crew. |
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