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Post by gedzilla on Mar 6, 2017 18:26:55 GMT
gedzilla Iridium is one of the denser materials like tungsten and osmium and depleted uranium. I used Iridium because its dense So kinetics then, but is it cost effective ? Cuase boron isnt very dense, but it has Gpa's of yield strength, so if its less dense, with more strength, why use a worse material ?
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Post by dwwolf on Mar 6, 2017 18:29:00 GMT
Graph areogel is bad vs lasers. It may function as a heatdiffuser under high melting point materials ( like the diamond/amorph carbon laser shield ).
But its main function is to act as whipple shield stuffing in meter(s) thick layers to catch plasma and fragments.
Si-gel is an ok antilaser material for its weight ( its better used as a nuke flash shield ) but it needs fairly thick layers to function as anti laser armor.
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Post by Enderminion on Mar 6, 2017 18:29:05 GMT
more armour, also its very dense which works wonders stopping larger and faster shots. I think, I'm no expert
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Post by tukuro on Mar 6, 2017 18:33:21 GMT
gedzilla it has a wipple shield and spall liner so against small fast bullets it is wonderful but if you start slinging larger slower rounds... Those slower rounds are never supposed to get anywhere near the ship. After all, that's where the 10G main propulsion is for. On the contrary, it's both effective and economical. Though it's designed to counter high-velocity (15 km/s) projectiles/needles, rather than multi-kg cannonballs. It's a comparatively cheap setup that's never more than 10% of the total cost on my ships and less than 1% of total mass. not enough armour for my tastes, I used (on the front of my big ship) Diamond (1mm) -> A-carbon (Centimeters) -> Diamond (0.5mm) -> A-carbon (centimeters) -> Aramid Fiber (a foot) -> Iridium (1cm) -> Boron (14cm) -> Para-Aramid Fiber (5cm) ...but is it cost effective? The aramid layer alone would cost as much as an entire fleet of my ships. gedzilla Iridium is one of the denser materials like tungsten and osmium and depleted uranium. I used Iridium because its dense Why not osmium with it's superior yield strength?
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Post by tukuro on Mar 6, 2017 18:36:50 GMT
Graph areogel is bad vs lasers. It may function as a heatdiffuser under high melting point materials ( like the diamond/amorph carbon laser shield ). But its main function is to act as whipple shield stuffing in meter(s) thick layers to catch plasma and fragments. Si-gel is an ok antilaser material for its weight ( its better used as a nuke flash shield ) but it needs fairly thick layers to function as anti laser armor. Graphite aerogel in-game has too high thermal conductivity, which makes it unsuitable as anti-laser armour. With the fixed value however it becomes effective. Not as effective as silica aerogel or aramid in terms of volume, but it makes up for that by being more cost effective and having the ability to double as anti-kinetic armour stuffing.
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Post by Enderminion on Mar 6, 2017 18:38:38 GMT
gedzilla it has a wipple shield and spall liner so against small fast bullets it is wonderful but if you start slinging larger slower rounds... Those slower rounds are never supposed to get anywhere near the ship. After all, that's where the 10G main propulsion is for. not enough armour for my tastes, I used (on the front of my big ship) Diamond (1mm) -> A-carbon (Centimeters) -> Diamond (0.5mm) -> A-carbon (centimeters) -> Aramid Fiber (a foot) -> Iridium (1cm) -> Boron (14cm) -> Para-Aramid Fiber (5cm) ...but is it cost effective? The aramid layer alone would cost as much as an entire fleet of my ships. gedzilla Iridium is one of the denser materials like tungsten and osmium and depleted uranium. I used Iridium because its dense Why not osmium with it's superior yield strength? from the top, heavy flak rounds can be delivered via missile going a good clip. the ship its on has never been killed although I have not yet test that particular hull, thinner plates of that composite shrug off nuclear strikes and absorb lasers very well (I use 0.5mm diamond 12mm A-carbon and 18mm Aramid fiber on missiles and they survived 9 600Mw lasers for an entire attack run 20/20). Osmium would most likely be a better choice but I wanted to be different.
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Post by tukuro on Mar 6, 2017 18:53:51 GMT
gedzilla Iridium is one of the denser materials like tungsten and osmium and depleted uranium. I used Iridium because its dense So kinetics then, but is it cost effective ? Cuase boron isnt very dense, but it has Gpa's of yield strength, so if its less dense, with more strength, why use a worse material ? For the outer kinetic layer - assuming the outer layer isn't a anti-flash layer - you want a material that is dense, but ductile and with low heat capacity. If it can't easily deform it will shatter and create secondary debris, while the latter ensures that any spall will turn into plasma, which can then be absorbed by the spall liner. There are a few materials that have these properties, while also being cheap: Tin, Cadmium and Lead. The next layer is the stuffing, in this case graphite aerogel because it is cost-effective compared to aramid fibre. For this layer you want high-heat capacity to absorb plasma. You can also use silica aerogel, but it will be much more expensive. Then you have the spall liner that absorb the kinetic impact of secondary debris, and the thermal energy of plasma. It need to have high-heat capacity, low moduli and yield strength. You can use spider silk as a cost-effective solution, but that tends to melt easily. Boron has high moduli, but it also has high yield strength, high melting temperature, high specific heat, is relatively cheap and has low density. With that in mind you can either add more stuffing-spall liner layers, or fill it up with anti-laser and anti-nuke armour, including an outer flash layer (aluminium/silver/molybdenum).
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Post by tukuro on Mar 6, 2017 18:58:09 GMT
Those slower rounds are never supposed to get anywhere near the ship. After all, that's where the 10G main propulsion is for. ...but is it cost effective? The aramid layer alone would cost as much as an entire fleet of my ships. Why not osmium with it's superior yield strength? from the top, heavy flak rounds can be delivered via missile going a good clip. the ship its on has never been killed although I have not yet test that particular hull, thinner plates of that composite shrug off nuclear strikes and absorb lasers very well (I use 0.5mm diamond 12mm A-carbon and 18mm Aramid fiber on missiles and they survived 9 600Mw lasers for an entire attack run 20/20). Osmium would most likely be a better choice but I wanted to be different. I've found that heavy flak and multi-megaton missiles are often large enough that they can be shot down by kinetic CIWS, or spread out laser drones/ships that can hit them from the sides.
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Post by gedzilla on Mar 6, 2017 19:07:39 GMT
What do you guys think of having two main layers, each with their own wipple shield ?
Example: 3.5mm Arimid Fiber (spall liner to main layer) 4cm Boron (last main layer) 20cm Silica Aerogel (stuffing) 7mm Diamond (wipple for last main layer) 2.5mm Arimid Fiber (spall liner) 2cm Boron (second main layer) 20cm Silica Aerogel (stuffing) 2.5mm Titanium The idea is you have a main layer, stuffing, wipple shield, second main layer (but a thinner main layer), stuffing and wipple.
It would be heavy and expensive as hell, but the protection It gives might be worth it
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Post by Enderminion on Mar 6, 2017 19:15:30 GMT
from the top, heavy flak rounds can be delivered via missile going a good clip. the ship its on has never been killed although I have not yet test that particular hull, thinner plates of that composite shrug off nuclear strikes and absorb lasers very well (I use 0.5mm diamond 12mm A-carbon and 18mm Aramid fiber on missiles and they survived 9 600Mw lasers for an entire attack run 20/20). Osmium would most likely be a better choice but I wanted to be different. I've found that heavy flak and multi-megaton missiles are often large enough that they can be shot down by kinetic CIWS, or spread out laser drones/ships that can hit them from the sides. when I said heavy flak I meant heavy flak pieces not a heavy bomb
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Post by tukuro on Mar 6, 2017 19:18:20 GMT
What do you guys think of having two main layers, each with their own wipple shield ? Example: 3.5mm Arimid Fiber (spall liner to main layer) 4cm Boron (last main layer) 20cm Silica Aerogel (stuffing) 7mm Diamond (wipple for last main layer) 2.5mm Arimid Fiber (spall liner) 2cm Boron (second main layer) 20cm Silica Aerogel (stuffing) 2.5mm Titanium The idea is you have a main layer, stuffing, wipple shield, second main layer (but a thinner main layer), stuffing and wipple. It would be heavy and expensive as hell, but the protection It gives might be worth it For bumpers between the main layers and the last spall liner I'd suggest something that's either very flexible so it doesn't create secondary debris, or something that melts. Also when doing multiple layers made from different materials you might want to put the most expensive materials closer to the centre to reduce surface area and volume.
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Post by gedzilla on Mar 6, 2017 19:20:51 GMT
What do you guys think of having two main layers, each with their own wipple shield ? Example: 3.5mm Arimid Fiber (spall liner to main layer) 4cm Boron (last main layer) 20cm Silica Aerogel (stuffing) 7mm Diamond (wipple for last main layer) 2.5mm Arimid Fiber (spall liner) 2cm Boron (second main layer) 20cm Silica Aerogel (stuffing) 2.5mm Titanium The idea is you have a main layer, stuffing, wipple shield, second main layer (but a thinner main layer), stuffing and wipple. It would be heavy and expensive as hell, but the protection It gives might be worth it For bumpers between the main layers and the last spall liner I'd suggest something that's either very flexible so it doesn't create secondary debris, or something that melts. Also when doing multiple layers made from different materials you might want to put the most expensive materials closer to the centre to reduce surface area and volume.
I thought Arimid Fiber was very flexible ?
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Post by tukuro on Mar 6, 2017 19:33:22 GMT
For bumpers between the main layers and the last spall liner I'd suggest something that's either very flexible so it doesn't create secondary debris, or something that melts. Also when doing multiple layers made from different materials you might want to put the most expensive materials closer to the centre to reduce surface area and volume.
I thought Arimid Fiber was very flexible ? Aramid is. But diamond and boron aren't. Also, if you just want good frontal armour you can just pick osmium, iridium, or tungsten carbide as your outer layer instead. The extreme density and hardness will cause projectiles to bounce off.
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Post by Enderminion on Mar 6, 2017 19:38:47 GMT
Why Tungsten Carbide instead of normal Tungsten tukuro ?
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Post by tukuro on Mar 6, 2017 19:44:36 GMT
Why Tungsten Carbide instead of normal Tungsten tukuro ? *Checks values* *Notices plane plain tungsten is just better* Uh, oh. Ignore that then. I tested Tungsten carbide because of it's high hardness, but I just realised it's much more expensive than Osmium or Iridium. Another material denser than lead, but cheaper than iridium and osmium is platinum. But it's not nearly as hard and is lacking in yield strength. EDIT: Herp derp I can't spell
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