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Post by Enderminion on Mar 6, 2017 19:45:38 GMT
Why Tungsten Carbide instead of normal Tungsten tukuro ? *Checks values* *Notices plane tungsten is just better* Uh, oh. Ignore that then. I tested Tungsten carbide because of it's high hardness, but I just realised it's much more expensive than Osmium or Iridium. Another material denser than lead, but cheaper than iridium and osmium is platinum. But it's not nearly as hard and is lacking in yield strength. plain not plane
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Post by Lukander on Mar 7, 2017 1:37:44 GMT
Would this be reasonable?
1cm PBO Fiber(final spall-liner) 1cm UHMWPE(main spall-liner) 6cm Boron(final main layer) 1.5cm Amorphoius Carbon(main layer heat-dump) 5mm Osmium(first main layer) 2 meter Graphite Aerogel('stuffed' gap layer) 5mm Lead(inner whipple shield) ~10cm mini-gap~ 1mm Basalt Fiber(minimal heat-resistant spall-liner) 3mm Amorphious Carbon(flash layer heat-dump) 2mm Diamond(outer flash layer coating)
admittedly the spall-liners could be cheaper and still also be affective.
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Post by Enderminion on Mar 7, 2017 2:51:54 GMT
the outer diamond coating could be 0.5mm thick and the A-carbon thickened a little bit, thats my only problem with that armour
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Post by Lukander on Mar 7, 2017 3:22:09 GMT
That was my minimal thickness version.
The heavy version would up the flash layer, it's thin spall-liner, and the Graph-Gel to 2.5 times the thickness. Double the Osmium main layer thicknes. Plus make Amorphious carbon 2cm and the Boron 8cm thick in the main layer. Finally I'd thicken both the final spall-liners to 1.5cm each.
I do wonder if moving the Amorphious Carbon layer behind the Boron in the main layer may be better? Might be less optimum thermally speaking but probably offer better spalling resistance. Unsure about which layer order(this or previous) would offer better general anti-kinetic characteristics...
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Post by RiftandRend on Mar 7, 2017 5:46:22 GMT
I don't see kinetic armor being cost-effective. The weapons we have can pierce through meters of solid osmium. Dodging kinetics is the best way to avoid damage. A thin hard layer to ricochet stray bullets might make sense, but don't expect it to take a beating. If you want to try kinetic armor anyway, you'll probably need to sandwich a few meters of aerogel in between hard layers. Of course, that makes you easier to hit... Against lasers, the overall best currently is nitrile rubber. I have found angling armor at over 80 degrees provide near immunity to any kinetic projectile.
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Post by apophys on Mar 7, 2017 6:13:35 GMT
I have found angling armor at over 80 degrees provide near immunity to any kinetic projectile. Not very reliable against sub-gram flak traveling >100 km/s.
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Post by newageofpower on Mar 7, 2017 6:37:22 GMT
I have found angling armor at over 80 degrees provide near immunity to any kinetic projectile. Not very reliable against sub-gram flak traveling >100 km/s. My 635km/s flak gun crashes the game every 2 shots. On the other hand, most reasonable targets die in one!
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Post by dwwolf on Mar 7, 2017 6:57:13 GMT
Does it rely on 10m empty spacers?
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Post by newageofpower on Mar 7, 2017 7:18:49 GMT
Does it rely on 10m empty spacers? Yeah it's completely physics borked. Oh, I've began playing around with multi Megaton-range NEFPs. Alas, they also causes crashes quite frequently as well ; (
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Post by The Astronomer on Mar 7, 2017 7:24:29 GMT
Does it rely on 10m empty spacers? Yeah it's completely physics borked. Oh, I've began playing around with multi Megaton-range NEFPs. Alas, they also causes crashes quite frequently as well ; ( bork
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Post by RiftandRend on Mar 7, 2017 7:32:37 GMT
Not very reliable against sub-gram flak traveling >100 km/s. My 635km/s flak gun crashes the game every 2 shots. On the other hand, most reasonable targets die in one! Wow, what's the per shot energy on that?
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Post by uberdude9001 on Mar 7, 2017 7:45:49 GMT
I've been having a lot of success with conservatively using Liquid Crystal Polymer Fiber sandwiched between Amorphous Carbon to make up for its poor thermal characteristics. It's quite expensive so must be used conservatively, but if you make your ship small(use decane or other dense propellant) you can use quite a lot of it.
I designed a ship weighing under 1kt that is nearly immune to fire from the stock gunship on the front using this technique.
I haven't tested it against the 100km/s sandblasters you guys have been building, does anyone have any designs I can test it with?
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Post by Lukander on Mar 7, 2017 7:48:54 GMT
Actually the 10cm gap between the outer flash layer and inner whipple shield serves two purposes: 1. Insulation, inhibiting direct(non-radiative) heat transfer between the flash layer to the inner(melt-y) whipple shield. 2. allows the inner whipple shield to work as intended: If a high velocity projectile blasts through the outer layer(which acts as a whipple shield in its own right) the plasma formed is non-conical in shape; crossing the gap and penetrating the second whipple shield causes it to form a cone, which disperses faster making it easier for the pressure wall to handle(less energy and mass per squared meter).
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Post by Lukander on Mar 7, 2017 8:02:50 GMT
A large gap between the flash layer and inner whipple shield is unnecessary to achieve the desired effects, it only serves to increase armor cross-section and surface area. Plus the Graph-Gel acts as a superior replacement for a large gap behind the inner whipple shield(just as volume intensive though).
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Post by dajuice on Mar 7, 2017 10:26:49 GMT
You say armor is not worth it, that lasers rule everything, and that needle swarms rule lasers. It could well be the conclusion that space combat is not viable, or that you need massive amounts of armor and fuel to do it. Maybe the concept if a crewed figthing spaceship is just not doable or a guaranteed suicide mission. The hyperspeed needle/mininuke swarm always gets through. Maybe it's mutually assured destruction.
The aftermath would be quite the Kessler syndrome though, millions of tungsten rods encircling the planet, with high relative speeds wherever you are.
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