blkcandy
Junior Member
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Posts: 78
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Post by blkcandy on Apr 13, 2017 11:21:09 GMT
Dear, Admirals.
While our space fleet must be flexible, RFP have found that its admirals tend to develop different preferred fleet composition/specialization after being granted authority to develop their own. Many even developed their own modules and spaceship which are tailored to their preference.
It has been a logistic hell. But RFP would like to maintain the rights of the admirals to develop their own fleet, as many of their designed ships and modules tend to break physics. And breaking physics is beneficial to RFP.
Thus, the department of logistic would like to survey the admirals' preferred fleet composition and doctrine, with the aims to reorganize the logistics for our admirals.
RFP fleet composition and doctrine survey.:
1. What is the composition of your fleet? Please list all classes/roles of spacecrafts of your preferred fleet.
2. What are the propellants consumed by your fleet?
3. What are your fleet primary/secondary weapon types, their ammunition types, and their ammo consumption?
4. What are your doctrine in ship design? For example: multiple small ships or few large ships, narrow angled frontal engagement ships or broadsiders, micro drones or capital drones, ETC.
5. Any other special logistic demand.
Please answer the survey and submit the survey to the department of logistic at your convenience.
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Post by bigbombr on Apr 13, 2017 11:36:31 GMT
1) Fleet composition? Laserstars, drone carriers, missile barges, laserstar/carrier hybrids. Capships and drones recieve a prefix based on armament. L for laser-armed craft, M for missile armed craft, K for craft armed with cannons, railguns or coilguns. If multiple letters apply, they're put in alphabetical order. E.g.: L Torch (laserstar), D Wellclearer (carrier), DL Sunbow (laserstar-carrier hybrid), K Grindstone (gunship), M Butcher (arsenal craft), L Candle (laserdrone). Weapons generally define role, so anything on top of armament prefix and specific name would be superfluous. No 'cruiser' or 'frigate' here!
2) Propellants? Water for MPDT capships and drones, pentane for NTR capships, pentane or MMH/DNTO for missiles. Drones use either water MPDT's or pentane NTR's.
3) Weapons and munitions? Drones (mostly laserdrones) and lasers. To a lesser extent, kinetic and fragmentation missiles. Drone nomenclature follows the same pattern as capships. Missiles recieve a prefix based on guidance and payload. KiMi for kinetic missiles, KiRo for kinetic rockets, FraMi for fragmentation missiles and NuMi for nuclear missiles. E.g.: FraMi Mummy (fragmentation missile), KiMi Spam (kinetic missile), KiRo Dart (unguided kinetic rocket), NuMi Blight (nuclear missile).
4) Design doctrine? Multiple small ships. Delta-v over raw acceleration. Frontal engagement. Drones both small and large. Flattened armour for enhanced protection.
5) Logistical demand? NTR craft tend to have 6-10 km/s of delta-v (and are meant for local operation), MPDT craft tend to have 20+ km/s of delta-v. Main combatants rely on plentiful delta-v and standoff munitions, lasers or a combination thereof. Tankers typically aren't needed, and I picked water as a propellant because IRL it allows for easy local propellant gathering.
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Post by Enderminion on Apr 13, 2017 11:49:41 GMT
1. mostly missile ships with a few laserstars, and one to two carriers 2. Decane for caps and H-F for missiles and drones, RP-1 when i need to go fast 3. primary weapons are missiles secondary are lasers 4. larger ships with pointed noses for frontal engaments 5. tankers for long range ops, and more missiles, 4mm railgun shots, and other special purpose rounds
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blkcandy
Junior Member
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Post by blkcandy on Apr 13, 2017 11:54:19 GMT
My answer to the survey:
1. My fleet is composed of super carrier (non-combat) and drones, with few multirole frigates for frontal drone command, accompanied by fuel tankers for long mission. The drones are capital class kinetic combat drone as main battle drone, laser interceptor drones as primary defense against drones/missiles, and 500t fuel tanker drones for logistic runs.
2. All units in my fleet uses decane as propellant. Nuke missiles uses LOX-Decane fuel.
3. My fleet weapon of choice are microflak railguns. Defense guns consumes 2x80mm 1g Selenium-nitrocellulose microflak needles. Main cannons uses 4x110mm 20g Osmium-Octogen microflak needles. Missiles are 1Mt unarmored defense missiles and 1Mt armored attack missiles. All lasers use Xenon gas and hydrogen coolants.
4. My design preferred multiple small spacecrafts and drones over large spacecrafts. The spacecrafts have minimal dV (3~4km/s) and thrusts (300mg-1g). They are to use frontal engagement using small size and angled armor for protection. The fleet employ tanker drones to compensate for limited dV. Kinetic drones are designed for ~100km engagement range. Frigates are to use lasers and missiles, control drones from distance, and avoid kinetic combat range.
5. Super tankers for long distance missions. And lots of U-233 dioxides. Lots.
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Post by dragonkid11 on Apr 13, 2017 12:47:45 GMT
1. Non-combat carrier with payload of sub-capital drones, fighter drones and missiles, only armed with defensive anti drone and missile laser. And light armored combat vessel below 1 kt mass for boosting the signal for drones and for parade purpose. 2. Mostly methane or hydrogen deutride for ships and drone, oxygen-hydrogen fuel for micro missiles. 3. Drones armed with all cannon types and missile swamp. 4. Doctrine is all revolved around drone. As stated above, fighter drones armed with all cannon types and missiles will be leading the front, supported by sub-capital drone with more payload of drones, missile and longer range railguns or coilgun as well as a defensive cloud of counter laser placed on defensive drones to destroy enemies's super laser platform. if that failed, super laser resistant missiles will be launched to defeat super laser platform first before launching more drones. In short, the entire doctrine is about launching as many drones and missile as possible at the enemies to minimize human life loss and reduce mass and cost as manned vessel tends to be more fuel dependent, having higher building cost and bigger in term of size. 5. Most carrier drone has MPD for long range travel, but if required, methane tanker drone will be deployed to refuel the sub-capital drone before combat.
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ndeo
Junior Member
It's not a flashlight... It's a High-frequency relativistic boson cannon
Posts: 67
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Post by ndeo on Apr 13, 2017 12:53:19 GMT
Fleet Composition - Subcapital: - Metalstorm Frigate MkII -- 1+
- Counterlaser ship -- 2
- Railgun sniper ship -- 1
Propellents Consumed: Ammunition Requirements: - 25mm Osmium slugs
- Standard 1g MMG pellets
Doctrine: Based on the idea of naval tactics on earth, the fleet is designed to hit hard, hit fast and disable the opposing ships before they get a chance to fire. The fleet is designed for medium to short range operation, but is capable of long range operations in special conditions. All ships have high Delta-V of at least 7+ Km/s with high acceleration (5G+). The counterlaser ships disable opposing ships' lasers and unarmored components from a distance, followed by the railgun sniper disabling long ranged weapons. Once long range weapons have been disabled, the Metalstorm frigates burn toward the target and fires it's array of guns broadside, with a 99% killrate if in range. Missiles are intercepted with the counterlasers unless they are disabled, in which the fleet expends fuel to outmanoeuvre the missiles instead. If the Metalstorm frigates are the the only surviving ships, the captains may choose to expend all fuel for a suicide run against the opposing ships.
In the event of a high-value target, a long range strategic missile may be launched from a missile silo armed with a 10.3MT Cassaba Howitzer to destroy the target.
Logistical Demands: The initial costs of the ships are low due to availability of materials required. However, maintenance may be of high expense due to the manpower required to inspect the array of 100 guns on the Metalstorm frigate and ammunition is required in very high amounts to compensate for the extreme rate of fire of the ships. The strategic missile silo has to be escorted with ships as it does not have any defensive weapons barring a point defence gun
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blkcandy
Junior Member
Burn complete. Crawling back to bed.
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Post by blkcandy on Apr 13, 2017 13:33:40 GMT
1) Laserstars and arsenal ships/missile barges. Approximately split 50/50. 2) Methane for capships and drones. Hydrogen-fluoride for missiles. 3) Missiles (flak and small nukes) and lasers. 4) Multiple small ships. Delta-v over raw acceleration. Frontal engagement. Drones, if used are small (sub 100 kg). 5) No logistical demands. All standard issue ships have over 10 km/s of delta-v, with most having over 12 km/s of delta-v. Therefore, there is little to no need for tankers. 1. mostly missile ships with a few laserstars, and one to two carriers 2. Decane for caps and H-F for missiles and drones, RP-1 when i need to go fast 3. primary weapons are missiles secondary are lasers 4. larger ships with pointed noses for frontal engaments 5. tankers for long range ops, and more missiles, 4mm railgun shots, and other special purpose rounds Lasers and missiles. I hate both. Lasers are annoying. AI counter lasers are inhumanly fast. They don't switch ships though. And radiators. Laser needs radiators. I hate having those. Especially when my fleet is centered around being as small as possible. And I hate intercepting missile salvo. It take a lot of time waiting missiles to get inside interceptor effective laser range. I often go have a meal or shower when intercepting missiles. Sure, nuke defense missiles are quicker, but it seems expensive. I'd rather intercept them with drones. 1. Non-combat carrier with payload of sub-capital drones, fighter drones and missiles, only armed with defensive anti drone and missile laser. And light armored combat vessel below 1 kt mass for boosting the signal for drones and for parade purpose. 2. Mostly methane or hydrogen deutride for ships and drone, oxygen-hydrogen fuel for micro missiles. 3. Drones armed with all cannon types and missile swamp. 4. Doctrine is all revolved around drone. As stated above, fighter drones armed with all cannon types and missiles will be leading the front, supported by sub-capital drone with more payload of drones, missile and longer range railguns or coilgun as well as a defensive cloud of counter laser placed on defensive drones to destroy enemies's super laser platform. if that failed, super laser resistant missiles will be launched to defeat super laser platform first before launching more drones. In short, the entire doctrine is about launching as many drones and missile as possible at the enemies to minimize human life loss and reduce mass and cost as manned vessel tends to be more fuel dependent, having higher building cost and bigger in term of size. 5. Most carrier drone has MPD for long range travel, but if required, methane tanker drone will be deployed to refuel the sub-capital drone before combat. We both uses swarm of drones. Mine is centered around sub-capital drones with laser drones support though. And my drones don't launch drone (or missile). Need to save all those spaces. Any drone or missile that are to be use in the engagement must be launched and ready prior to the actual engagement. So is serious engagement, the engaging fleet starts with big cloud of missiles and drones floating on standby. I empathize on saving space to the point of limiting dV to make the drones smaller and rely on tanker drone instead. I am even considering reducing combat unit dV from 3~4km/s to 2~3km/s. Right now they still have a third dV remaining after battle so it should be enough. Managing tanker drones would be annoying though. Since then it would most likely need to have tanker refuel combatants after the engagement. Fleet Composition - Subcapital: - Metalstorm Frigate MkII -- 1+
- Counterlaser ship -- 2
- Railgun sniper ship -- 1
Propellents Consumed: Ammunition Requirements: - 25mm Osmium slugs
- Standard 1g MMG pellets
Doctrine: Based on the idea of naval tactics on earth, the fleet is designed to hit hard, hit fast and disable the opposing ships before they get a chance to fire. The fleet is designed for medium to short range operation, but is capable of long range operations in special conditions. All ships have high Delta-V of at least 7+ Km/s with high acceleration (5G+). The counterlaser ships disable opposing ships' lasers and unarmored components from a distance, followed by the railgun sniper disabling long ranged weapons. Once long range weapons have been disabled, the Metalstorm frigates burn toward the target and fires it's array of guns broadside, with a 99% killrate if in range. Missiles are intercepted with the counterlasers unless they are disabled, in which the fleet expends fuel to outmanoeuvre the missiles instead. If the Metalstorm frigates are the the only surviving ships, the captains may choose to expend all fuel for a suicide run against the opposing ships.
In the event of a high-value target, a long range strategic missile may be launched from a missile silo armed with a 10.3MT Cassaba Howitzer to destroy the target.
Logistical Demands: The initial costs of the ships are low due to availability of materials required. However, maintenance may be of high expense due to the manpower required to inspect the array of 100 guns on the Metalstorm frigate and ammunition is required in very high amounts to compensate for the extreme rate of fire of the ships. The strategic missile silo has to be escorted with ships as it does not have any defensive weapons barring a point defence gun
That seems like a lot of propellant consumption. A lot. How did you manage ballooned size problem? dV and Thrust don't get along.
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Post by samchiu2000 on Apr 13, 2017 14:02:44 GMT
May i know how much credit can be used to build our fleet? blkcandy Then we may be able to design our fleet more precisely~
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blkcandy
Junior Member
Burn complete. Crawling back to bed.
Posts: 78
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Post by blkcandy on Apr 13, 2017 14:06:43 GMT
This is not a challenge, just survey of admirals preferences. You can always ask budgets from your mother, the prime minister of RFP.
The PM has a lot of children though, LOL.
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Post by HeinzPepperoni on Apr 13, 2017 14:32:03 GMT
1. What is the composition of your fleet? Please list all classes/roles of spacecrafts of your preferred fleet. 2. What are the propellants consumed by your fleet? 3. What are your fleet primary/secondary weapon types, their ammunition types, and their ammo consumption? 4. What are your doctrine in ship design? For example: multiple small ships or few large ships, narrow angled frontal engagement ships or broadsiders, micro drones or capital drones, ETC. 5. Any other special logistic demand. 1-3) 1x "Graf Strachwitz" class Fleet Carrier - Armament: 40x "Kestrel" heavy drones, 120x "Bee" mini-drones, 40x "YOHANE-A 406" Anti-Ship missiles, 20x Nuclear missiles. 4x "Wooby" class Missile Frigates - Armament (For each frigate): 300x "Wing-man Mk.II B-2" anti-escorts missiles, 20x "YOHANE-A 406" Anti-Ship missiles, 30x "Buzzkill A-1A" Anti-swarm missiles, 2x 4mm Rail gun 2x "Peashooter" class Fleet Defense Corvette - Armament (For each corvette): 1x "STAR-KILLER" Long-range 5mm Rail-gun, 2x "GAU-8008 AP" 30mm Cannon. The fleet is always instructed to swarm the enemy with missiles before launching drones to mop up the remaining enemy forces. Nuclear missiles in anti-ship roles to be used only as a last resort. Ammo consumption is around 400-500 Wing-man missiles, 40-60 YOHANE-A per engagement. Depending on the enemy response and fleet composition, Drones and anti-swarm missiles may be used as well. Usually, 5-10 Anti-swarm and all mini-drones are used in such cases. 2) Decane for ships, Fluorine-Hydrogen for Missiles. 4)As small and as cheap as possible, sharing as many components as well. uberdude9001's armor design, with a custom scheme: More armor at the front and the rear (to protect the engine from missiles) and less in the mid-ship. These ships are never meant to broadside anyway. 5) More soda, please, since we seem to run out too quickly.
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Post by samchiu2000 on Apr 13, 2017 14:36:22 GMT
This is not a challenge, just survey of admirals preferences. You can always ask budgets from your mother, the prime minister of RFP. The PM has a lot of children though, LOL. 1.Mostly small (1.08Mc, 400t, 10k missiles) missile boat and some small(2.35Mc, 497t, 1k laser drone) laser drone carrier. Ratio~10:1 2.Methane for the micro capital ship and fluoride hydrogen for drone and missile 3.Micro(~4.5kg, 16.8c~) missiles to destroy enemy ship and small(~1.4kc, ~75kg) laser drones to destroy enemy laser 4.Large number of micro capital ship to overrun the enemy~ 5.I have a ~15kt methane tanker for long range mission~
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ndeo
Junior Member
It's not a flashlight... It's a High-frequency relativistic boson cannon
Posts: 67
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Post by ndeo on Apr 13, 2017 15:02:49 GMT
That seems like a lot of propellant consumption. A lot. How did you manage ballooned size problem? dV and Thrust don't get along. Not really, a 1 KT tank is enough for 7Km/s and 10Gs of acceleration. The exhaust velocity for the NTR is 8.10km/s with a TWR of 246Gs but are quite expensive and there's probably a better one by someone else.
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Post by darkwarriorj on Apr 13, 2017 16:19:09 GMT
1. Medium-small generalist missile-laser cruiser with MPD drive. Approx. 4MC and 700 tons or so.
2. Water for the for vessel large enough to mount a nuclear rocket (Because thematically I like it; not because it's good), fluorine-methane for the expendables like the missiles.
3. Primary expendable/offensive weapon: The fleet's sheer number of micromissiles. Primary enduring/defensive weapon: The fleet's lasers.
4. The key feature fleet are: 1. Situational adaptability. 2. Large numbers of ships over module redundancy. 3. Specialization to the point of generalization. 4. Whole greater than the sum of its parts. 5. Everything serves multiple purposes.
The key gimmick of this fleet is: Extreme high-speed laser-missile charge to wipe the enemy off the map in one blow.
The design process went like this: So, we want a laserstar. This entails a strong nuclear reactor, and a powerful laser, along with some crew. But wait, we can turn it into a warship with absolutely absurd delta-V by adding on an MPD and some fuel tanks. Now, missile ships also need a high amount of delta-v, to accelerate their missiles to extreme high speed, giving them much more kinetic energy and less time under fire as they close in on their target. That also entails a strong nuclear reactor, some crew, fuel tanks and MPDs. The only variance between them is the missiles and the lasers. So why not have both? One worry may be that the missiles and lasers interfere with each other; the additional mass from the two hamper the optional functionality of the warship. However, lasers and missiles have two separate niches - the first as enduring assets, the second as expendables. As for thrust reduction, doubling the mass will cut the thrust in half, but minimal armor (the lasers serve as the primary line of defense) and lower mass helps in that regard, plus accelerating for a missile assault is slow anyways. Once close in combat is started, the missiles can all be fired and drop tanks dropped, and what we're left with is effectively a normal laserstar. Thus, generalist design is a go.
Also, the ship will be designed to fight head on, presenting its large laser aperture at the front and the edges of its radiators. Ideally, the nuclear rockets would be mounted on the sides as dodge rockets, but the AI doesn't seem to be capable of comprehending that so nuclear rockets remain mounted on the back. Armor is minimal and meant to work only against lasers, depending on dodging, countermissiles and lasers to serve as the fleet's primary defense. No drones for now, though the entire above fleet could be turned into a capital drone fleet as far as I can tell so that's another possibility.
5. Nope, the fleet should be able to handle everything on its own. This said, having a few water tankers around would be nice.
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Post by jasonvance on Apr 13, 2017 16:34:45 GMT
1. long range laser drones (500kc / 117t) / missile drones, and the station / carrier to deploy them from 2. Neon MPDs for ships/drones (cheapest total cost propellant), Hydrogen/Florine combustion for missiles 3. Lasers / missiles so ammo isn't really a thing (missiles are between 1,000 and 100c each so depending on the cost limits there can be thousands but the game only really supports ~400 at a time without crashing) 4. Large 20x cost optimized 1Mm laser arrays on the nose built on the cheapest unarmored hull that can move it around effectively. The main fleet doctrine is long range glass cannon damage output and cost effectiveness 5. No real logistical needs the drones tend to be outfitted with ~20km/s delta-v but can scale up to 200km/s if needed for some reason with just more fuel.
The setup could pretty much be boiled down to a slider of "how many missiles to bring along with the lasers"
75Mc of lasers would be 150 drones with 3000 1Mm lasers total along with 25Mc of missiles which could be 250,000 attacker missiles or 25,000 with the longer range and slightly larger payload
I would probably be more heavy on missiles if the game didn't crash from large swarms.
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Post by samchiu2000 on Apr 13, 2017 16:37:41 GMT
1. long range laser drones (500kc / 117t) / missile drones, and the station / carrier to deploy them from 2. Neon MPDs for ships/drones (cheapest total cost propellant), Hydrogen/Florine combustion for missiles 3. Lasers / missiles so ammo isn't really a thing (missiles are between 1,000 and 100c each so depending on the cost limits there can be thousands but the game only really supports ~400 at a time without crashing) 4. Large 20x cost optimized 1Mm laser arrays on the nose built on the cheapest unarmored hull that can move it around effectively. The main fleet doctrine is long range glass cannon damage output and cost effectiveness 5. No real logistical needs the drones tend to be outfitted with ~20km/s delta-v but can scale up to 200km/s if needed for some reason with just more fuel. The setup could pretty much be boiled down to a slider of "how many missiles to bring along with the lasers" 75Mc of lasers would be 150 drones with 3000 1Mm lasers total along with 25Mc of missiles which could be 250,000 attacker missiles or 25,000 with the longer range and slightly larger payload I would probably be more heavy on missiles if the game didn't crash from large swarms. Oh 3000 doom laser... Juicy target for my micro laser drone~
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